JackL
new member
Reged: 03/10/04
Posts: 16
Loc: Seattle
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Hi everybody,
There seems to be a movement (among non-racers) these days toward raising the handlebars to nearly level with the saddle. I agreed with the idea, and, for the past 2 years, have raised the bars on my most-ridden bikes to about 2-4 cm below the saddle. I didn't find any change in comfort. Yesterday, I flipped the stem back over to the (correct) lower position which dropped the handlebars to about 8-9 cm below the saddle. After a 50-mile ride, I felt a little more neck pain but LESS pressure on my hands & wrists.
How could this be? Here's my half-baked theory: If you bend your back halfway, your back muscles have to work to keep your torso in the proper position. If you bend your back a lot, it your back muscles are naturally stretched close to their limits and don't have to work so hard. Also, your abdomen muscles are more bunched up and act as a stop to further bending.
Anybody else find lower bars more comfortable?
JackL
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Dave_Thompson
prophet
Reged: 12/19/03
Posts: 720
Loc: Spokane, Washington
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I've raised my bars in the recent years and find it more comfortable for me. I've found that as the bars come up the stem length has to increase, otherwise distance from the bars to saddle decreases. Which is what may have happened to you. When you flipped your stem, the effective length increased, which took the weight off your hands and wrists and you have to use your arm and chest muscles to hold you up.
Try this; see you have or can borrow a stem that will bring your bars back up to where they were. The stem would have to be about 10cm longer than the one you had originally. See if the installation of that stem in the 'high' bar position takes the weight off your hands and wrists. Usually excessive weight on hands and wrists are caused by being too close to the bars and locking your elbows. Your arms should be bent, absorbing shocks and taking some of the weight from your hands.
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Steel lover, but then I like Ti with carbon too.
Licensed bike geek.
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RDP
captain
Reged: 12/18/03
Posts: 245
Loc: Kansas
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Jack,
Interesting observation and by coincidence I have been tweaking (lowering) my position using my ergo stem and it felt surprisingly comfortable (I rode on the hoods and went into the drops here and there). I also experienced soreness in the neck for the past two days but it seems to be diminishing.
You may be on to something. I was using a slightly higher position (8 cm saddle to bar drop) but then I kept my hands in the drops (same difference?) but since I have the option to drop down lower whenever I want so I may continue to do so. Should be telling as my mileage and fitness increase.
Another drawback of a higher position is the body acting as a hood scoop when cruising on the flat. It feels more efficient lower as long as you can settle into a comfortable position at the points of contact.
Please keep us posted on your positioning/ride results.
-R
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It is about the bike.....BikeFanClub Forums
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 Lon
sage
Reged: 12/20/03
Posts: 595
Loc: Pittsburgh, PA
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I ride in what would be considered a low postion. I find it comfortable. The drop is at the max that I have read in recommended distance. I usually ride on the hoods and I use the drops when descending for a very low center of gravity, cornering on hard corners, and if I want to be more aero.
The one change I have made lately is to raise my levers similar to how Lance and a lot of Postal have theirs. A friend who races, computer fits, wrenches etc. set up my one bike that way and I liked it so much I changed the other two over.
I find being low and stretched out is fine for comfort. 
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Cory
new member
Reged: 02/05/04
Posts: 16
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If it works for you, use it. Personally, though, I raised my bars three years ago when I bought my Atlantis (I figured if I was buying Grant's frame, I'd follow his recommendations for setting it up), and it's the best change I've made, next to a triple crank, in almost 30 years of cycling.
Granted that I'm an old guy and never was very flexible, but the combination of bars level with the saddle and a Brooks B-17 means I'm more comfortable after two hours than I used to be after 30 minutes. I still have an Allez set up old school, with the seat higher than the bars. I've used it for three or four centuries and hundreds, if not thousands, of shorter rides, and I used to think it was fine. I can hardly stand to ride it now.
Edited by Cory (04/13/04 04:53 PM)
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TJeanloz
new member
Reged: 02/05/04
Posts: 20
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I love the right vs. wrong argument when it comes to positioning, especially with respect to recreational cycling.
We used to have people come into the shop for a fit saying: the position I'm using is really comfortable for me, but I know it's "wrong". The answer to which is, if it's comfortable, it is right, regardless of what John Cobb says.
Now, if you're trying to win a race, it gets a little more complicated - but in the recreational world, whatever is the most comfortable is the most right.
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OldEd
contributor
Reged: 02/05/04
Posts: 117
Loc: The Great South
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of course I believe in situational positioning.
TJ's right. In the recreational world, what feels best is best.
The problem is (if it IS a problem, which I'm not sure it is) most folks get used to a certain position vis a vis bar height, it's a pain in the ass to experiment with different positions (especially with those threadless abominations) so they never truly discover if there indeed is a much more comfortable height.
Experimentation usually begins when pain becomes intolerable. Not the greatest of situations, but maybe not all that bad either. I tend to think our bodies will accomodate any number of size/position variables. The search to "dial in" to the final, perfect millimeter seems both anal and feckless, in the real world of the Average Joe.
I have my quill stem jacked up way high like Grant says, though. Just because Grant says it and that's good enough for me.
Edited by OldEd (04/13/04 07:00 PM)
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Dave_Thompson
prophet
Reged: 12/19/03
Posts: 720
Loc: Spokane, Washington
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OldEd, even though you're an old liberal, you've hit the nail on the head, metaphorically speaking. There is no one correct position for any rider at any time, other that what feels good now. Riding hills or riding flat centuries often dictate different riding positions.
Because I do primarily organized rides, I have an idea what I'm in for several weeks before the ride. If it's hills, the stem goes down, (note that I have a quill stem on 2 of my bikes OldEd) if it's long and/or somewhat flat, the stem comes up. In the case of one of my bikes being threadless (sorry, I couldn't get it any other way) I have 3 different stems, one of which I install depending on the situation.
So for you old liberals out there, it's called situational positioning. Anyone else can call it choices.
//I'mOldTooDave
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Steel lover, but then I like Ti with carbon too.
Licensed bike geek.
Edited by Dave_Thompson (04/13/04 09:15 PM)
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easypedaler
contributor
Reged: 02/08/04
Posts: 149
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Whatever works is what you need to go with. 
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