dbrk
contributor
Reged: 12/18/03
Posts: 201
Loc: Finger Lakes, New York
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I've never been terribly impressed with the welds on Pinarellos since they went to TIGs and the weld has no effect, of course, on the ride. It is purely an aesthetic matter. But it is interesting to me that Italian bike companies, concerned as they are with fashion and aesthetics, actually tolerate the sort of work that routinely turns up on these bikes. With few exceptions (uhhh...Dario....), I am prodigiously unimpressed with the welds. To wit, this one is from a Dogma that is currently on eBay (the ad is itself a testiment to how not to sell a bicycle...if you ask me). Look here, though I'd post the .jpg if I could figure out how to do this in the course of this post...:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=22681&item=3672392059&rd=1
Again, no one rides welds and they only need not to fail but this is gloopy and ugly. I suppose American bicycles spoil us because when you look at welds from the likes of IF, not to mention Moots over on the ti side of things, then you see real quality and care. I'd rant further about the goofy SL fork but marketing suggests that Pinarello has sold enough of these to make some believe its shape matters. I _want_ to try another Pinarello of this modern ilk but I remember selling my Opera not only because I bought a bike too small but because the workmanship past the paint, which was excellent btw, was, well, like this one.
dbrk
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DGauthier
new member
Reged: 12/18/03
Posts: 21
Loc: Los Angeles, CA
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I completely concur. It is very obvious when surveying the current crop of frames for sale these days that the very best ones are now made right here in the good old U. S. of A. The best bicycles might have been made in Europe at one time, but clearly this is no longer the case. It's a great time to be a cyclist in America.
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BadgeJohn
new member
Reged: 04/01/04
Posts: 14
Loc: PA, USA
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While the welds of some bikes that are TIG welded from both Italian and US maufacturers has much to be desired, the main reason they can be untouched is strength. Unless you take and INSANE amount of time to go over each weld individually with Filler and paint drop by drop, the only way to smooth out a TIG weld is to miter it down which can remove strength from the surface. If you don't like the look of such welds, you can buy other materials. Ti, which can be welded smooth by the nature of the material, or go with steel which can be lugged or Fillet, or CF. Especially with Aluminum "ugly welds" are going to be the norm simply for strengths consideration. Those that are smooth either have a patented process (Klein), or miter the welds which I would be worried about.
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HE who dares, Wins
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dbrk
contributor
Reged: 12/18/03
Posts: 201
Loc: Finger Lakes, New York
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While it is true that overheating and passing over a lug can cost strength, I must demur from the notion that Pinarello's Dogma is not worth the time or effort to do better. The welds on the examples I have seen are messy, not just ugly. This may be a feature of the material being so very difficult to work with and it may be a positive inasmuch as BadgeJohn rightly notes that too much heat makes the welds less strong. But I have three simple points:
1. This Dogma costs how much? And we are supposed to think that welds that look like this are just part of the deal and we should think this is okay because? Pinarello could not take the INSANE amount of time (not my notion, but Badge's) to get these more pleasing at this cost?
2. Comparable AL welds from DeRosa are about...uhh....a million times better. Look at Principia for handsome toothpaste welds. Look at Cannondale for smoothed over welds that don't fail. Somehow I think Pinarello might match their peers on a bike that costs this much and purports to be the top of the line.
3. Badge is quite correct: we have other choices. I certainly won't be choosing Pinarello because this sort of workmanship speaks to values that I cannot share.
dbrk
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YeOldeBaldeOne
new member
Reged: 05/12/04
Posts: 2
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There are Italians that make nice welds, like this one;
http://www.bikefanclub.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=906&size=big&password=&sort=1&cat=514
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