Dana
new member
Reged: 09/28/04
Posts: 18
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Is anyone randonneuring on their Calfees? I'm still awaiting my new Calfee which I've designed for local bike rides or really anything up to 200-300km. Eventually I would like to do a little touring or longer rides that require loading to go multiple days self-supported.
Anyone added racks and fenders and gone this route? Any advice?
Thanks,
Dana
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bfd
journeyman
Reged: 12/22/03
Posts: 77
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You state that you are "still awaiting my new Calfee which I've designed for local bike rides or really anything up to 200-300km". So a few questions:
1. did you design in clearance for fenders and wider tires?
2. what kind of fork are you using?
3. if carbon fork, will it be one designed for cyclocross, thus adding more clearance?
4. are you getting strong or more "stout" tubing?
5. Was Craig receptive to this type of riding? What kind of input, if any, did he make?
I believe Calfees are definitely strong enough for loaded-tours. The problem is that because they are designed with "race" geometries, there's little or no clearance for wider tires, let alone fenders. My Calfee with kestrel fork has enough room for 700x25, but anything wider won't fit. Thanks, Brewster
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Dana
new member
Reged: 09/28/04
Posts: 18
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No, I didn't ask Craig or plan for any loaded touring on this bike. I did try to aim for comfortable over distances rather than the lightest weight.
I went with the Ouzo Pro fork.
The impression I'm getting is that with perhaps a few small considerations at this point (stout tubing, more clearance) that I should be able to get the bike now but be able to slap on the gear later for a loaded tour?
Thanks,
Dana
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bfd
journeyman
Reged: 12/22/03
Posts: 77
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Depends on what you want. You stated you wanted fenders. Well, unless the Reynolds Ouzo fork, which is a great fork, has been redesigned, its my understanding that the largest tire you can fit under that fork is 700x25. There's no room for fenders.
Don't get me wrong, I use 25s and like them alot. But, I don't need fenders on my "go-fast" bike. Alternatively,
you could get those SKS ones that bolt on, but I don't think they're very good and most people who use fenders would never consider it. \
As for a rack, Calfee does not offer eyelets. So, you'll probably have to get some p-clamps and/or zip ties to mount the rack. Can be done. For "loaded touring", you may also want to look into a saddle bag that mounts under your seat. Jobst Brandt uses one on his annual tour of the alps:
http://www.paloaltobicycles.com/alps_photos_by_thumbnails.html
Good Luck.
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Bruce
contributor
Reged: 12/27/03
Posts: 133
Loc: North of NYC
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Dana,
You are tying to make the classic "tradeoff" between light/responsive and comfortable comparison, but that really does not apply to Calfee frames. Let me explain:
In the past, with steel, AL, or Ti frames, you had three design criteria (stiff, light, comfortable), but you could only pick 2. Steel was stiff and comfortable, but not light, AL was stiff and light, but not comfortable, and Ti was light and comfortable but not stiff unless you got into the steel weights. But with CF you have a different equation, stiff, light, comfortable, and cheap, pick any 3, and you can't pick cheap! Now Ti and AL manufacturers are trying to get on the CF band wagon by adding carbon bits to the bikes. Next time you see one of these metal frame makers who add carbon bits here and there, ask them why if carbon is so good for the folk (ever see a Ti bike with a Ti fork, or an AL bike with an AL fork?) or other bits, why isn't the rest of the bike carbon? Watch them studder and stammer and start talking about proprietary tubing and wall thicknesses. The bottom line is they know carbon is better, they are just too stupid to know how to make a good carbon bike.
I have a 16lb DFly that is stiff, obviously light (for a 60 cm frame), and is the most comfortable bike I have ever ridden. I have done 320k multiple times on it and feels like I have not ridden a bike at the end. Tired, but not sore.
So you don't need to worry about comfort on a Calfee. That is assumed. Add a pair of Topolino wheels and you are really talking comfort.
I do know some brevet cyclists who ride Calfees. As far as loaded touring on carbon, you would be on the cutting edge of that. I imagine Craig could add the bits you need. Basically a touring fork, fender bolts, larger wheel clearances, and eyelets on the rear dropouts (easy since they are machined Ti). You might also want to go with disk brakes. These are now light enough they would work well for a touring bike. I would also use stronger tubing on the entire bike. Nothing like packing an additional 20k on a bike to make it sway and flex.
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Dana
new member
Reged: 09/28/04
Posts: 18
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It is impossible for a bike to do all things or at least to do all things well. I've tried to gear my Luna toward comfort on long rides including the Topolino wheels so I should be in good shape for some brevets this coming year. I will have to put some lights on and a rack but the fenders aren't critical and I don't really have to carry anything more than I can fit in a rack bag, handlebar bag and Camelbak MULE.
In order to go beyond brevets to loaded touring I would need lower gears than my compact crank gives me as well as the stiffer frame that you mentioned. I'm satisfied that I can carry a bunch of stuff if I want and I'll remain comfortable for the rides I want to do right now.
In 5-10 years when the children aren't around then I can think about taking off a couple of weeks for some loaded touring. I can get a new bike with that in mind when that happens.
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vandeda
new member
Reged: 12/17/04
Posts: 14
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CF can offer stiff, light and comfortable ... but overall .... light usually doesn't always offer durability. I say "durability" in terms of from abuse. I will probably sell my Dragon Fly Pro next spring. Why? because most of my riding is for commuting. I currently use a 1988 Centurion Le Mans that I got for free. Put front & rear pannier racks, some fenders, and I was good to go. My Dragon Fly will be replaced with a Vanilla which will be built around October/November of next year.
In talking with Sacha at Vanilla, I told him the thing I like about the Centurion is the durability. Quite frankly, I could probably dump this thing out my 2nd story bedroom window and ride on. Actually, this bike has seen some minor accidents that included hitting the frame (I admittedly don't pay enough attention riding at night ....) Aside from scratched paint .... the frame is still perfect. The bike has fallen over fully loaded ... oh ... what a beatiful sound it makes when it hits the ground ... but unscathed. I am a little bit clutsy no doubt.
The Dragon Fly ... with the carbon ... it's not forgiving at all. A mild scratch could be catastrophic at some point ... could be, but maybe not. IMHO, it won't stand to the abuse of everyday use with 15/20 lbs hanging off the back wheel (or front wheel ... the Centurion has the most forgiving geometry) and eek ... I would be a bit frightened to hang panniers off the thing ... the bike just seems .... like it's paper thin fragile. And considering the tubes are nearly that thin ... no thanks.
I told Sacha that I don't want any fancy butted tubes ... just straight gauge ... something that after 20 years of hard, loaded use, will still be going.
just my $.02
Dan
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Dana
new member
Reged: 09/28/04
Posts: 18
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I definitely understand where you are coming from about durability. I am currently still riding my 1978 Gitane with its lugged steel frame. I have changed components over the years as necessary (and sometimes not necessary) as well as having a rack and fenders. I even repainted it myself once (that was an ordeal!) I decided to treat myself to a completely new bike this time and I expect to love the ride but it might not be my loaded touring bike when I have an opportunity to do that again. I see club rides and some long brevets in my future for the next few years but no loaded touring. When that time comes, I can look at a new bike, consider a trailer or just put the rack back on the Gitane (I took it off to cut the weight down to 29lbs). ha ha
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Bruce
contributor
Reged: 12/27/03
Posts: 133
Loc: North of NYC
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Dana,
A Luna with Topolino wheels will be a very sweet and comfortable ride.
Yes, a bike can not do all things well, but a Calfee can do the range from light touring (no big packs), day touring, long distance, fitness riding, training rides, all the way up to pro racing. As a road bike, it would not be suitable to offroad and loaded touring.
I use my DFly for all the first set of uses I listed first (well maybe not pro racing). For my daily commute and touring I use a custom steel frame make for me by Rob Stowe in Rochester. It used to be my favorate bike until I got the DFly.
As far as durability goes, it depends on the problem. Steel frames crack, so they are not forever either. I would way CF is well suited for the application of a bicycle frame, and probably better than AL, or Ti for most uses, but steel would be better for loaded touring.
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flythebike
captain
Reged: 08/26/04
Posts: 272
Loc: N. Virginia, USA
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I toured for about 10 days in Catalonia and Provence with a mid 90s Look KG carbon fiber frame, one of the bonded w/al lugs models, on tubulars. I affixed a rack to the seatstays and brake bridge. I rode a 39x23 or some such ridiculously large gear and only carried about 15 pounds on the bike, and a few things in a messenger bag. Just two pairs of regular shorts and two shirts, and two pairs of bike shorts and two jerseys, a lightweight sleeping bag, and a one-person tent, and other such small items as needed. On flat roads the bike was totally fine, and even on steady climbs. Grinding out of the saddle up steep grades was cause for some rear triangle flex. But overall, the bike did very well. I navigated carefully to avoid anything more than a Cat. 4 climb, although I encountered some uncategorized climbs that were harder than the one Cat. 4 climb I went over. Using caution, even descending was ok. The Calfee is much stronger than that old Look design (which I won a race on, so I'm not knocking it too hard), so I think the frame could take the strain.
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Dana
new member
Reged: 09/28/04
Posts: 18
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It was a good thing that I looked into this now. They will add eyelets for a rack and a rear fender. I will definitely need a rack, the fender is optional. I can still put a small fender on the front that mounts to the quick release even with the Ouzo Pro fork.
If I had talked with them about it earlier, I could have added a reinforced area for mounting a kickstand. 
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Bruce
contributor
Reged: 12/27/03
Posts: 133
Loc: North of NYC
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Kickstands!! Gotta love them.
The other day, as I was walking in town, I noticed a cyclist at the local deli trying to get her kick stand to work. The bike would not say up, as the sidewalk has a slight downward slope by design to keep the water away from the building, and she had the kickstand on the wrong side. She was obviously a novice with the kickstand, but she had a fairly nice bike. Don't know why she had a kickstand. Anyway, I showed her how to lean the bike against the wall and other bike without needing a kickstand.
I think bike shops sell kickstands so experienced riders know who to stay away from on club rides, plus it is a extra profit item when they come back to get it removed. They probably just have about 10 they rotate through all the newbie riders.
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