Darby
sage
Reged: 08/03/06
Posts: 441
Loc: Orange County California
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I am considering buying a set of rollers or a trainer to improve my performance and to use when I can't ride.
Anyone use both rollers and a trainer? Most of the reviews I have read favor the Kreitler over a trainer. What I want is a machine that will improve my hill climbing capabilities. I have heard that rollers will do this and also improve my overall riding skills.
I found a used set of Kreitler rollers with the fan on them. I would add the fork stand so I could use it like stationary bike.
Bruce
Edited by Darby (12/22/06 05:13 PM)
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Jeff
friend
Reged: 01/29/04
Posts: 68
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I just bought my first set of rollers from www.trutrainer.com/ I'm still learning how to use them but they are really well built and from my research the best out there if you can afford them.
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Darby
sage
Reged: 08/03/06
Posts: 441
Loc: Orange County California
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Quote:
Jeff wrote:
I just bought my first set of rollers from www.trutrainer.com/ I'm still learning how to use them but they are really well built and from my research the best out there if you can afford them.
These look like some great rollers. I do like that they have a flywheel so it possible to coast on them. They are also more expensive than the Kreitler Rollers. I wonder if a Kreitler fork stand could be used with them?
Bruce
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dfcas
contributor
Reged: 12/19/03
Posts: 143
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I had Kreitlers and currently have Sportcrafters rollers,and a Kurt Kinetic road trainer.
rollers are for high cadence spin/technique type training,not heavy gear climbing type training. I use rollers to warm up,work on spin and such,but I use the trainer to work on power.
if I had to choose 1,I would choose the trainer because you can just zone out,work on big gears,watch TV,listen to music,drink and eat.
Rollers require intense concentracion and riding off of them is not much fun.I've done that a few times and can't recommend it.
dan
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no signature
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Darby
sage
Reged: 08/03/06
Posts: 441
Loc: Orange County California
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Quote:
dfcas wrote:
I had Kreitlers and currently have Sportcrafters rollers,and a Kurt Kinetic road trainer.
rollers are for high cadence spin/technique type training,not heavy gear climbing type training. I use rollers to warm up,work on spin and such,but I use the trainer to work on power.
if I had to choose 1,I would choose the trainer because you can just zone out,work on big gears,watch TV,listen to music,drink and eat.
Rollers require intense concentracion and riding off of them is not much fun.I've done that a few times and can't recommend it.
dan
Hi Dan,
What I need to work on is Power. A steep hill kicks my butt right now. I thought about the Kreitler Rollers because I can put a fork stand on it and use the fan accessory which is suppose to increase the resistance.
I have also looked at Kurt Kinetic machines. They make two types that I am also considering. One is the Road Machine and the other is the Pro. The Pro has the option of having up to an 18 lb flywheel. The Road Machine has a 6 lb flywheel. I am not sure if that option is worth another $100 or not. Is suppose to improve the ride quality and is better for long rides.
Thanks for responding,
Bruce
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Dave_Thompson
prophet
Reged: 12/19/03
Posts: 720
Loc: Spokane, Washington
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Power doesn't come from rollers, they are to improve your techique, your spin, your balance and your endurance.
Use a trainer for power development, along with squats, lunges and other weight training type exercises. If you can ride throughout the winter, nothing will get you better climbing hills, than climbing hills!
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Steel lover, but then I like Ti with carbon too.
Licensed bike geek.
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Jeff
friend
Reged: 01/29/04
Posts: 68
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Quote:
Dave_Thompson wrote:
Power doesn't come from rollers, they are to improve your techique, your spin, your balance and your endurance.
Not sure if I agree with this statement as it applies to the TruTrainers. They have good "road feel" and in my so far limited use you can sit there a pump a steady 300 or more watts for as long as you can hold it (not long in my case)! Seems to me that should develop power and as a side benefit your using more muscle to balance and stay on them so you get a more complete workout.
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Darby
sage
Reged: 08/03/06
Posts: 441
Loc: Orange County California
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Quote:
Dave_Thompson wrote:
Power doesn't come from rollers, they are to improve your techique, your spin, your balance and your endurance.
Use a trainer for power development, along with squats, lunges and other weight training type exercises. If you can ride throughout the winter, nothing will get you better climbing hills, than climbing hills!
Hi Dave,
I can ride through the winter. The winter is mild here.
I wanted a trainer or rollers so that I can train after dark or before sunrise. But, I do agree that the best way to improve my performance on hills to climb more hills; and I have some really nasty ones within a 5 minute ride of my house. If I can conquer these hills, I would think that my endurance on the flats would also improve.
I might just stick with the hills for now and put off the purchase of a trainer / rollers. The hills are close and they are free.
Bruce
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1centaur
journeyman
Reged: 12/24/03
Posts: 126
Loc: Massachusetts
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I have a Kurt, a Computrainer and E-motion rollers. If I had to own one it would be the Computrainer because it gives you hills to climb and I became a much better climber due to that feature (the Alpe and Ventoux were notable achievements). #2 choice for most purposes including hills would be the Kurt (I have the road machine - very good) because a good trainer gives you the most options, including mindless calorie burning or knee grinding, slow cadence out-of-the saddle hill "simulations." The rollers I have include various resistance settings which simulate the high wattages of hills BUT the thing with hills is they fluctuate in grade and that interacts with your leg muscles (and heart rate) in ways that are not always conducive to keeping on smoothly turning the cranks, which is the main usage for rollers.
I like rollers to finish off your stroke and make you efficient/faster overall, but I view them as a luxury vs. the bread and butter of working on a trainer.
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"You never make a gift of Ventoux"
Eddie Merckx to Lance Armstrong
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Darby
sage
Reged: 08/03/06
Posts: 441
Loc: Orange County California
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Quote:
1centaur wrote:
I have a Kurt, a Computrainer and E-motion rollers. If I had to own one it would be the Computrainer because it gives you hills to climb and I became a much better climber due to that feature (the Alpe and Ventoux were notable achievements). #2 choice for most purposes including hills would be the Kurt (I have the road machine - very good) because a good trainer gives you the most options, including mindless calorie burning or knee grinding, slow cadence out-of-the saddle hill "simulations." The rollers I have include various resistance settings which simulate the high wattages of hills BUT the thing with hills is they fluctuate in grade and that interacts with your leg muscles (and heart rate) in ways that are not always conducive to keeping on smoothly turning the cranks, which is the main usage for rollers.
I like rollers to finish off your stroke and make you efficient/faster overall, but I view them as a luxury vs. the bread and butter of working on a trainer.
I have wondered about the Computrainer. It comes with some cool interactive software, but how does the hill program work? Can you vary the resistance through the Computrainer or do you just use the bike's gears? Other than the programs it has, does it do anything else better than the Kurt?
By the way the Computrainers are quite costly. Aren't they over $1,000?
Also, I hear a lot about trainers being hard on frames and wearing out tires quickly. Should this be a concern? I have an extra set of wheels and could throw on some cheap tires but I would need a spare cassette.
Bruce
Edited by Darby (12/24/06 01:53 AM)
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1centaur
journeyman
Reged: 12/24/03
Posts: 126
Loc: Massachusetts
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Computrainer increases the resistance in proportion to the gradient, so you are forced to change your gears just as you would on a real hill. The interaction with you PC is really the point of it - the actual wheel on flywheel resistance is much like the Kurt, but the training impact of the CT is far preferable.
Yes, it's very expensive - over $1,000.
Both Continental and Tacx make trainer specific tires that are quiter, wear slower, and have a little better grip on the flywheel. I could not recommend them more highly. They are not for the road, so they are suited for trainer only bikes or trainer-only wheels. I don't view trainers as being very hard on frames compared to the stresses of most roads, but I endorse the idea of a trainer only bike which can be WAY cheaper than a normal bike as it just has to fit and have decent shifting and cranks - it can be heavy, any material, you can use cheaper components, etc. If it's on the trainer you won't have an excuse not to ride it. If you have any worries about trainers hurting frames, that takes care of it. Old steel bikes for $100 on e-Bay can be great trainer bikes.
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"You never make a gift of Ventoux"
Eddie Merckx to Lance Armstrong
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ayoung
new member
Reged: 02/13/07
Posts: 1
Loc: New York City
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I have been using Kreitlers for 3 wintners. The smaller diameter drums are helpful especially if you have the fan attachment but they are not really for hill work. I love them though and often will jump on them in Summer if I do not have time for a real road workout. I suggest not using the stand and learning how to balance. You will get a more intense workout and once you learn to balance you will find your bike skills on the road much improved. Vary your roller workouts by letting your tire pressure go down to 90-95 for more resistance. I also mix it up each week: A long steady cadence workout of 1 hr with 30 mins at threshold, next a 20 mile workout with 2 mile sprints at 4-6 mi/ 9-11 mi/ 14-16 mi and a last mile sprint 19-20 mi. For hill work when it is too cold/dark (I do this all year though) I have been doing stair sprints for the last 3 years. 5 sprints of 14 flights each over about 25 mins 2-3 times a week. I am lucky & can do this at work. When I go out in the Spring I find I have not lost too much and quickly start climbing well. Oh, and use sweatguards. I also recommend tennis wrist bands to keep your hands and bars free of sweat.
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Darby
sage
Reged: 08/03/06
Posts: 441
Loc: Orange County California
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Quote:
ayoung wrote:
I have been using Kreitlers for 3 wintners. The smaller diameter drums are helpful especially if you have the fan attachment but they are not really for hill work.
Thanks for sharing your experience. Rollers are currently on my wish list even more so than a trainer. I was considering a trainer for increasing my speed and strength and the rollers for balance. However, I live in a warm climate and can ride almost every day of the year. I also live within 7 minutes of some really nasty hills. What I am lacking, however, is the ability to ride in a straight line. I try riding on the 4" white line of the bike lane but can only do it for a few feet. So, I think the Rollers would be useful for improving my skills.
Bruce
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skuke
captain
Reged: 12/22/03
Posts: 323
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Quote:
Darby wrote:
I try riding on the 4" white line of the bike lane but can only do it for a few feet. So, I think the Rollers would be useful for improving my skills.
Bruce
Don't stare at the line (directly in front of your tire) you're trying to ride. Watch the road and line maybe 20-40 feet in front of you, but don't focus on the line. Scan all in your field of view (like when driving your car) (at least that's how I hope you drive your car).
Next, don't put a "death grip" on the bars. Relax your hands on the hoods or wherever you prefer to keep them. Keep you elbows bent!!!! and relax your shoulders too.
Staring at the line directly in front of yourself and gripping tightly to make micro-corrections is VERY tiring (physically and mentally). You'll also put yourself in harm's way because you will be less aware of your surroundings.
Have someone follow you when you try the above and I think you might be surprised at how straight you're capable of riding.
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Skuke
95 Carbonframes Tetra Pro
92 Bridgestone MB-1
90 Moser 51.151
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Darby
sage
Reged: 08/03/06
Posts: 441
Loc: Orange County California
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Quote:
skuke wrote:
Staring at the line directly in front of yourself and gripping tightly to make micro-corrections is VERY tiring (physically and mentally). You'll also put yourself in harm's way because you will be less aware of your surroundings.
Have someone follow you when you try the above and I think you might be surprised at how straight you're capable of riding.
Thanks for the pointers. I was having difficulty on the declines too and a friend suggested relaxing my grip on the bar. It is funny how something so simple can make such a big difference. I will give you suggestions a try.
Regards,
Bruce Darby
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