daveaux419
new member
Reged: 12/14/07
Posts: 5
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I have been searching like most people do when in the market for a carbon frame and I have narrowed it down to three, Calfee Dfly, Crumpton SL, and RUEGAMER Zen. I live in Louisiana and don't have any experience with any of these bikes. My info,like most, has come from forums and websites.
To make this short and sweet, considering build quality, stiffness, lightness, and most important overall ride. Does any one have any experience on any of these frames or any opinions about these frames?
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Darby
captain
Reged: 08/03/06
Posts: 384
Loc: Orange County California
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Quote:
daveaux419 wrote:
I have been searching like most people do when in the market for a carbon frame and I have narrowed it down to three, Calfee Dfly, Crumpton SL, and RUEGAMER Zen.
I have owned two Calfees and I couldn't be happier with the ride quality, performance and support from Craig Calfee and company and from network of other Calfee owners. I have not owned a Crumpton but have read good reviews on the bike. However, the price listed on Crumpton?s website for a SL shows that the frame is about $800 more than a Dragonfly. I have no knowledge of the Ruegaer Zen.
One more thing to consider is the warranty and reparability of the frame. Craig Calfee has earned a reputation of not only being an artist at repairing Calfee frames but other manufacturer?s frames as well. If you can break it, Craig can fix it.
Bruce
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daveaux419
new member
Reged: 12/14/07
Posts: 5
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You hit on one of the main points gearing me towards the Calfee, Warranty! It says a lot about a frame when it gets a 25 year warranty. The only thing that I question about Calfee, is if he up on the new technology out there. Then again I am not up on it either. Thanks again!
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Darby
captain
Reged: 08/03/06
Posts: 384
Loc: Orange County California
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Quote:
daveaux419 wrote:
You hit on one of the main points gearing me towards the Calfee, Warranty! It says a lot about a frame when it gets a 25 year warranty. The only thing that I question about Calfee, is if he up on the new technology out there. Then again I am not up on it either. Thanks again!
Well, I admit I am not too knowledgeable on the latest technology either. I think that some companies change their products every year just so that their customers will buy new stuff every year and have the latest and greatest. I ride with a guy that has a 2007 Specialized and he wants to sell it and buy a 2008 Specialized. When I ask him what the difference is, all I get is that the 2008 has a different paint job and graphics on it. So the real difference is cosmetic. My 2004 Tetra looks exactly like a 2007 Tetra. Calfee makes minor upgrades but they change very little which I like. This makes a used Calfee more desirable than many other brands of bikes. Calfee is also the only company that I am aware of that will allow a warranty to be transferred from the original owner to a second owner.
I think that Craig makes changes to his bikes as better materials become available. The Dragonfly, for instance, uses Boron along with Carbon to reduce weight.
Bruce
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daveaux419
new member
Reged: 12/14/07
Posts: 5
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Thanks again, as I read more and more and read what you have written, my decision is becoming more clear. Do you know if Craig would have some photo's of some recent D'flys he has done? Thanks, you seem like one of those guys who is not caught up in all the hype with the crazy carbon world of mainstream bikes.
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Dave_Thompson
prophet
Reged: 12/19/03
Posts: 714
Loc: Spokane, Washington
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Quote:
daveaux419 wrote:
Thanks again, as I read more and more and read what you have written, my decision is becoming more clear. Do you know if Craig would have some photo's of some recent D'flys he has done? Thanks, you seem like one of those guys who is not caught up in all the hype with the crazy carbon world of mainstream bikes.
You would be welcome to all Craig directly at Calfee, he's a terrific guy and more than happy to tell all about his bikes. He's been doing carbon for near 20 years now and has always been leading the way. My first Calfee was a '94 and I've had two more since then. My wife has had her Tetra Pro for 5 years and won't part with it.
Anyone that can build conventional bikes, as well as recumbents and tandems, with carbon as long as he has must be doing something right!
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Steel lover, but then I like Ti with carbon too.
Licensed bike geek.
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Darby
captain
Reged: 08/03/06
Posts: 384
Loc: Orange County California
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Quote:
daveaux419 wrote:
Thanks again, as I read more and more and read what you have written, my decision is becoming more clear. Do you know if Craig would have some photo's of some recent D'flys he has done? Thanks, you seem like one of those guys who is not caught up in all the hype with the crazy carbon world of mainstream bikes.
Another reason that I like Calfee so much is that they have been extremely helpful every time I have had to call them. If you were to call Calfee, I am sure they could find some photos of a new Dragonfly to send you. You might also want talk with Craig about the Dfly.
Before I bought a Calfee I was convinced that I wanted a titanium bike. I road several ti bikes some costing twice what a new Calfee Luna cost. Then, I thought I would try a few carbon fiber bikes and rode a Calfee. I only had to ride a Luna about 20 feet to know that something was different about it. I ended up riding it maybe a 1/2 mile and from that point forward have been a Calfee fan.
A Calfee delivers on everything that I want in a bike. The order of importance on a bike to me is first and foremost, ride quality, then performance and then durability and repairability. Styling and looks take a distant fourth place. Well, a Calfee has a wonderful ride quality, is a capable performer and probably among the most durable and repairable carbon fiber bikes made. As I said styling is not very important to me. My Tetra has a nude finish which some think has an industrial look but to me I like it much better than paint. A nude finish is much more durable than paint and weighs less than paint.
I am not too enthused with the current crop of high tech looking carbon bikes that I have seen. I haven't seen another bike I would trade my Calfee for.
Good luck with your research,
Bruce
Edited by Darby (12/15/07 07:16 AM)
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daveaux419
new member
Reged: 12/14/07
Posts: 5
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Thanks for the great feed back, I am going to call and get some pics of a D'fly. I was also woundering if anybody reading this has ridden any of the other bikes I mention on the first post. Thanks again for all of the feed back.
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Umlungu
contributor
Reged: 03/04/05
Posts: 178
Loc: Plano, TX
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I have only ridden Calfee but have heard many good things about Crumpton as well. Rue is kinda a new kid on the block if my memory serves me right and in fact I believe I read someplace that Rue got his start at Calfee. How's that for a ringing endorsement for the Master.
Personally I think you will be happy with whichever frame you end up going with. They are all great frames - to me its like trying to decide between a Ferrari and Lambo.
Most of us here are just partial to Calfees (for good reason). Good luck and let us know what you end up going with.
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Bruce
contributor
Reged: 12/27/03
Posts: 133
Loc: North of NYC
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Dave,
I would add the following:
Looks like both non-Calfee frame you are looking at are very similar to how Calfee makes his, hand wrapped carbon. I would go with the guy who has been doing it the longest and offers the best warranty.
Why don't you ask these other carbon builders if they will build you a full carbon triple with S&S couplers that will couple to a tandem. When they say "no way", you will then know who is the best carbon builder around. Check out the photo gallery for a coupled carbon triple. I don't know of any other carbon builder that would attempt that bike.
I bought one of the first DFlys back in 2001. It has been an excellent bike and I still don't know of a frame that is significantly better in any aspect.
Apparently these other builders don't offer their frames in nude, ie. no paint. Paint add weight and chips. Why do they need to paint the frames? To cover something up? Carbon does not need to be painted, just covered in a sun screen when you clean the bike. And with the money you will spend on the bike, you will want to make sure it is clean, so spend the extra 5 minutes and make the frame look new by applying sun screen.
Bruce
PS. I hope you plan to put Record or Red on the bike. Don't buy a light weight frame and stick DA on it. It has no carbon parts and is about 1/2 lb heavier than Record. Plus it looks ugly as sin. Campy is nice on a carbon bike because of all the carbon they use. I don't have any experience with SRAM Red, but I hear it is lighter than Record. Friends don't let friends ride ShimaNo!
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daveaux419
new member
Reged: 12/14/07
Posts: 5
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Thank you very much for the feed back. I as read through these I am getting the feeling that Calfee is one hell of a builder. Every question I have asked from, Calfee up with new Technology, to warranty, I am really satisfied with this forum. I hope to have my new bike by the first of next year and I think it's going to be a D'fly. If any other person reads this, does calfee plan on changing the D'fly any time soon?
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skuke
captain
Reged: 12/22/03
Posts: 311
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Quote:
daveaux419 wrote:
If any other person reads this, does calfee plan on changing the D'fly any time soon?
I doubt it, but I don't have any inside info. All I can say is that my 1995 Carbon Frames (Calfee) Tetra Pro has only had some incremental, evolutionary changes since I've purchased my frame. I've had some of those changes incorporated into my frame. ie. bottle cage mounts are now CF pads with a stud rather than a Ti band around the tubes. The rear dropouts were originally two pieces able to be unbolted, I had them welded together and I believe the lastest rear dropouts are different still (one piece). I had these changes made when I moved the shifter bosses from the downtube to cable stops on the head tube for my Record Ergo levers. The newest cable stops are different than mine, I've noticed.
In short, Calfee doesn't change for the sake of change. The changes to my frame were based on need after feedback from many riders. ...if the rear dropout bolts came loose and fell off, catastrophic failure could result. Welding was a secondary safety. I'd feel confident that (almost) any changes made to the D'Fly could be incorporated into your frame in the future and the frame you buy "tomorrow" would be the lastest from the factory.
Welcome to the family.
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Skuke
95 Carbonframes Tetra Pro
92 Bridgestone MB-1
90 Moser 51.151
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skuke
captain
Reged: 12/22/03
Posts: 311
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Quote:
Bruce wrote:
And with the money you will spend on the bike, you will want to make sure it is clean, so spend the extra 5 minutes...
Dang, I'm supposed to clean my bike? ...I wash it once a year whether it needs it or not!
Quote:
Friends don't let friends ride ShimaNo!
Lets see, I have Record Ergo, Suntour XC Pro, and Sachs Galli. Yup, no ShimaNo!
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Skuke
95 Carbonframes Tetra Pro
92 Bridgestone MB-1
90 Moser 51.151
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Dave_Thompson
prophet
Reged: 12/19/03
Posts: 714
Loc: Spokane, Washington
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Quote:
skuke wrote:
Quote:
Bruce wrote:
And with the money you will spend on the bike, you will want to make sure it is clean, so spend the extra 5 minutes...
Dang, I'm supposed to clean my bike? ...I wash it once a year whether it needs it or not!
Quote:
Friends don't let friends ride ShimaNo!
Lets see, I have Record Ergo, Suntour XC Pro, and Sachs Galli. Yup, no ShimaNo!
Hah! All four of our Calfees have been Shimano equipped. Still running strong. 
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Steel lover, but then I like Ti with carbon too.
Licensed bike geek.
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Darby
captain
Reged: 08/03/06
Posts: 384
Loc: Orange County California
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The lugs on the D'Fly were changed in 2005. Prior to 2005, they looked like the lugs on a Luna. The newer lugs are sculptured. They do look better but I think the reason for sculpturing the lugs was to distinguish a D'Fly from a Luna.
Bruce
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skuke
captain
Reged: 12/22/03
Posts: 311
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Quote:
Dave_Thompson wrote:
Hah! All four of our Calfees have been Shimano equipped. Still running strong.
Ironically, I think DA shifts faster and more precisely than Record.
But, can you buy replacement parts to upgrade an 8 speed DA to 9 or 10 speed like you can with Record. Heck, can you even get replacement parts for Shimano after about 3 years? Is Shimano even rebuildable?
Not that it matters in this context, but how many racers NOT named Lance have won the Tour de France with a Shimano group?
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Skuke
95 Carbonframes Tetra Pro
92 Bridgestone MB-1
90 Moser 51.151
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Dave_Thompson
prophet
Reged: 12/19/03
Posts: 714
Loc: Spokane, Washington
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Quote:
skuke wrote:
Quote:
Dave_Thompson wrote:
Hah! All four of our Calfees have been Shimano equipped. Still running strong.
Ironically, I think DA shifts faster and more precisely than Record.
But, can you buy replacement parts to upgrade an 8 speed DA to 9 or 10 speed like you can with Record. Heck, can you even get replacement parts for Shimano after about 3 years? Is Shimano even rebuildable?
Not that it matters in this context, but how many racers NOT named Lance have won the Tour de France with a Shimano group?
It really not matters at all. I like the way Shimano works and fits for me. I had a chance to ride Campy equipped bikes when riding in Italy this year and while they worked well, just didn't fit my hands like I'd prefer.
Not so much a matter of superiority of one over the other, but of personal preferences. Ford or Chevy type thing.
I'll ride Campy in Italy again next summer, it's all good.
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Steel lover, but then I like Ti with carbon too.
Licensed bike geek.
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skuke
captain
Reged: 12/22/03
Posts: 311
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Quote:
Dave_Thompson wrote:
It really not matters at all. I like the way Shimano works and fits for me. I had a chance to ride Campy equipped bikes when riding in Italy this year and while they worked well, just didn't fit my hands like I'd prefer.
Not so much a matter of superiority of one over the other, but of personal preferences. Ford or Chevy type thing.
I'll ride Campy in Italy again next summer, it's all good.
Ironically, again, I completely agree with you! While I still think DA shifts better, I much prefer Record for their repair-ability/upgrade-ability and Campy's position on not having planned obsolescence. But to each his/her own.
I've owned a Chevy Vega and Ford Pinto! I'm a Prius owner now.
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Skuke
95 Carbonframes Tetra Pro
92 Bridgestone MB-1
90 Moser 51.151
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Bruce
contributor
Reged: 12/27/03
Posts: 133
Loc: North of NYC
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Quote:
I'll ride Campy in Italy again next summer, it's all good.
Dave,
Which company are you going with? We went with Ciclismo Classico this summer and are doing the same next summer. One reason I like them is they furnish Italian bikes with Italian parts. Fitting if you are going to ride in Italy. Ciclismo runs a great tour. Highly recommended!
Bruce
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Dave_Thompson
prophet
Reged: 12/19/03
Posts: 714
Loc: Spokane, Washington
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Quote:
Bruce wrote:
Quote:
I'll ride Campy in Italy again next summer, it's all good.
Dave,
Which company are you going with? We went with Ciclismo Classico this summer and are doing the same next summer. One reason I like them is they furnish Italian bikes with Italian parts. Fitting if you are going to ride in Italy. Ciclismo runs a great tour. Highly recommended!
Bruce
Bruce:
We're not fond of tours, we typically arrange our own travel and accomodations. We stayed at the Belvedere Hotel in Riccione this last May. It's on the east coast of Italy in the Rimini region and a hotbed of cycling. The Belvedere is an Italian bike hotel, catering to cyclists. They have their own bikes (DeRosa) daily rides of different lengths and difficulties and some of the very best food I had in Italy. It's a half block from the beach with it's own spa and wellness center, it has staff bike mechanics, tour leaders and did I mention the food? ( ) We like it so well that we've booked our 2008 cycling vacation there again. A terrific place. If you'd like more info, e-mail me ( davetspokane1@comcast.net )
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Steel lover, but then I like Ti with carbon too.
Licensed bike geek.
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Bruce
contributor
Reged: 12/27/03
Posts: 133
Loc: North of NYC
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Dave,
Recognized the first photo. We went through the same gap on our trip from Fano across Italy. Fano is just down the coast from Riccione. Maybe well check them out for 09.
We had a blast on the tour. Something new every day. This year we are doing southern Italy coast to coast over the top part of the shoe of the boot.
This guy did a great web page on the trip. We had the same guides for our trip.
Southern Italy Sea to Sea
Looking forward to another great trip.
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Dave_Thompson
prophet
Reged: 12/19/03
Posts: 714
Loc: Spokane, Washington
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The Furlo Gap is quite a sight and quite a ride! A one lane road through the tunnel is, er, interesting! We had lunch at the restaurant right at the gap beside the river, beautiful!
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Steel lover, but then I like Ti with carbon too.
Licensed bike geek.
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